I've been trying to stay away from politics on this board recently, and especially Obama, but have any of you guys seen this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHEO_fG3mm4

Apparently the Black Eyed Peas frontman, and Bob Dylan's son got together and produced this video without Obama's knowledge. I think it's powerful stuff. Makes me feel proud to be an American.

Well, it's certainly well-done artistically. And it's powerful stuff if you agree with his ideas. If you disagree with the Leftist agenda, though, it just makes you frustrated than people could fall for such sentimental irrationality.

David

Obama is the most liberal guy in the Senate, and is even MORE liberal than Hillary.


McCain is going to whip both of them with independents and moderate dems. Of course, if Rush limbaugh and Ann Coulter have their way, some of the GOP base will stay home.

Yeah, I'm curious about the latest antics of Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh. They're not helping their party.

I know Obama's pretty liberal--just saying. This wasn't something that the Obama campaign was even involved in, and Jessie Dylan says he wasn't even sure Obama was aware of it. One thing that I keep saying about Barack is that... regardless of your beliefs about him... he really does ignite people and inspire them to be a part of their government and country. He lights people on fire.

That's what makes me proud to be an American right now. I think this election cycle, I see the American people getting involved again. And that makes me really happy, regardless of who they vote for.

I just wish there were more viable candidates to chose from. It seems all we get are folks that are polarizing. Why can't we get candidates instead of politicians anymore? Give me some new ideas, (not new age crap - just new ideas) and something/one I can get excited about.

Hoff, it's certainly true that Obama is a great salesperson. He would be great doing seminars for motivation or self-improvement -- sort of like Tony Robbins or something. But someone's presentation skills have little to do with whether he's a good leader in the long run. Think about it this way. Even Democrats could concede that Reagan was a good communicator who connected well with people and inspired them, but that doesn't mean that Democrats should have supported him.

Obama is talented as a communicator, but he's only worth supporting if you agree with his political agenda. Since you support his agenda, his communication skills are obviously much more appealing than they would be to those of us who find the ideas dangerous.

Flyboy, the reason we have the politicians that we do is because PEOPLE VOTE FOR PEOPLE WHO TELL THEM WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR. Yes, I'm shouting, because it frustrates me.

David

quote:

Originally posted by David309:
Hoff, it's certainly true that Obama is a great salesperson. He would be great doing seminars for motivation or self-improvement -- sort of like Tony Robbins or something. But someone's presentation skills have little to do with whether he's a good leader in the long run. Think about it this way. Even Democrats could concede that Reagan was a good communicator who connected well with people and inspired them, but that doesn't mean that Democrats should have supported him.

Obama is talented as a communicator, but he's only worth supporting if you agree with his political agenda. Since you support his agenda, his communication skills are obviously much more appealing than they would be to those of us who find the ideas dangerous.

Flyboy, the reason we have the politicians that we do is because PEOPLE VOTE FOR PEOPLE WHO TELL THEM WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR. Yes, I'm shouting, because it frustrates me.

David

Dear David,
Be sure to piss on every ray of hope you can find. Don't leave a spark, man, because it just might be enough.
Peace. Out.

Note to Obama: With you as President...No we can't.

quote:

Originally posted by Sleepless in TN:

quote:

Originally posted by David309:
Hoff, it's certainly true that Obama is a great salesperson. He would be great doing seminars for motivation or self-improvement -- sort of like Tony Robbins or something. But someone's presentation skills have little to do with whether he's a good leader in the long run. Think about it this way. Even Democrats could concede that Reagan was a good communicator who connected well with people and inspired them, but that doesn't mean that Democrats should have supported him.

Obama is talented as a communicator, but he's only worth supporting if you agree with his political agenda. Since you support his agenda, his communication skills are obviously much more appealing than they would be to those of us who find the ideas dangerous.

Flyboy, the reason we have the politicians that we do is because PEOPLE VOTE FOR PEOPLE WHO TELL THEM WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR. Yes, I'm shouting, because it frustrates me.

David

Dear David,
Be sure to piss on every ray of hope you can find. Don't leave a spark, man, because it just might be enough.
Peace. Out.

I don't have any hope about it. Zero. I work in politics, and I see that things are far worse on the inside than people on the outside can imagine. Lots of people still believe the fables they learned in junior high school civics classes. On top of that, they're irrational and want everything that politicians promise them -- even if any sane person would understand that what's being promised is impossible.

If you want a lot of insight into real voter behavior (and why things aren't going to get better any time soon, IMO), read, "The Myth of the Rational Voter: Why Democracies Choose Bad Policies," by Dr. Bryan Caplan. If you still have hope for democracy after that, you're just not paying attention.

http://www.amazon.com/Myth-Rational-Voter-Democracies-Policies/dp/0691129428

David

Do you think Obama voted no for the war the whole time,because he does not want Americans on Islamic soil ? Since he studied Radical Islam.

quote:

Originally posted by mdavis:
Do you think Obama voted no for the war the whole time,because he does not want Americans on Islamic soil ? Since he studied Radical Islam.

No. There's not the slightest evidence for that. He presumably voted against the war because he didn't want the United States to aggressively start a war against a country that was no threat to us. There was a time when we could say that the United States only fought wars when we were attacked. We can't say that anymore, because Iraq (even under a brutal dictator) was no threat to us and certainly hadn't attacked us.

As I've made plain on here, I'm totally against what Obama stands for, but it's disgusting how these religious attacks are made against a man who has a long history as a Christian.

David

David, although you've been working in politics for awhile, I'm starting to enter in that door, and definitely understand what you're saying. Anyone who thinks we actually vote fairly for the leaders of this country are nuts. George Washington Puckett would LOVE the world we live in at the moment.

I ordered that book offa Amazon, by the way.

That being said, the President doesn't really have any power to do anything tangible themselves once they get in office, except through things like Bush is doing, skirting around the Constitution by using executive order, etc. I don't trust any of them to do what they say they're going to do.

That's why communication/inspiration skills are so important to me. As the figurehead of America, I think it's fundamental that our President has the ability to get the people behind him, and get them excited and fired up about things. I tend to not vote based solely on issues for the reason that I know it doesn't matter that much.

Hoff, the president doesn't have the power to do MOST of what he does these days, but he gets away with it. And that's true of both Republicans and Democrats. When you read the Federalist Papers (as I'm sure you have), it's clear that the president wasn't expected to be very powerful. His powers were severely limited. So most of what has become the modern Imperial Presidency has come from power-hungry presidents taking power when they could get away with it, not from the powers granted by the Constitution.

It's true that Congress technically has the power (and has spent the last hundreds years or so greatly expanding the power of the federal government), but I think the tone the president sets with his "bully pulpit" has a lot to do with the stupidity that the Congress passes.

There's one thing that we agree on, though. It doesn't matter much who you vote for. (And I'm not even talking about the notion that one vote never makes a real difference.) It doesn't matter much in the long run who gets elected. I think we're headed down such a dark and ugly road that we're going to get there no matter who's in the White House. That's because I think it's too late to save much remnant of the freedom we had.

Sorry to be so depressing. I pray I'm wrong, but I don't see any hope.

Please let me know what you think of the book. It can be very disillusioning to those who still have faith in democracy. The only chapter which I feel is very weak is the last one. He tries to be optimistic by laying out some ways in which the problems he outlines can be solved. I think his solutions are just as bad as the problems themselves. I think he just can't bring himself to end the book without trying to negate the gloom that the entire book logically lays out.

David

quote:

Originally posted by David309:
Hoff, it's certainly true that Obama is a great salesperson. He would be great doing seminars for motivation or self-improvement -- sort of like Tony Robbins or something. But someone's presentation skills have little to do with whether he's a good leader in the long run. Think about it this way. Even Democrats could concede that Reagan was a good communicator who connected well with people and inspired them, but that doesn't mean that Democrats should have supported him.

Obama is talented as a communicator, but he's only worth supporting if you agree with his political agenda. Since you support his agenda, his communication skills are obviously much more appealing than they would be to those of us who find the ideas dangerous.

Flyboy, the reason we have the politicians that we do is because PEOPLE VOTE FOR PEOPLE WHO TELL THEM WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR. Yes, I'm shouting, because it frustrates me.

David

I'm confused David - are you yelling at ME? If so, you are proving my point. I don't want a salesman - I want a leader. Someone who has shown through example what he believes. Someone who has beliefs in the same things I do and who has the intestinal fortitude to stand up to a bunch of cowardly, left wing, give the country away liberals. The last couple dozen years only fortifies the reasoning of our founding fathers when they distributed power evenly across the 3 branches of government. The system is broke because the voters broke it! Why in the crap can someone like Ted Kennedy be consistently returned to office? Why do we keep sending the rest of the goobers to Washington like we do? And Hoff - the current administration is not the first to use Executive orders.

No, Flyboy, the "yelling" wasn't AT you. It was just frustration at the subject I was commenting on.

David