All you're showing is how bad a coach Dinardo was.
he's in good company with a great Bama Alum, Curley Hallman.

That doesn't make Saban great anymore than Mike SHula was when he was 8-0.

Saban is a good coach a good coach can walk into greatness because of the talent and the program and the fan bas at LSU.

That doesn't mean Saban is so great he can turn every program he touches around.

If so what happened at Miami where he had all the money and control he wanted?

True that Hallman and DiNardo were both really bad coaches.

Saban is a really good coach and an excellent recruiter and he will bring the talent to Alabama just like he did at LSU.

You can't talk about the NFL when the salary cap and drafting are involved. Just look at Jeff Fisher at the Tennessee Titans, is he a terrible coach? Fisher had three consecutive losing seasons but in 1999 had a team that came up less than a yard short in the Super Bowl and the salary cap issues ruined the team for those years. Now they are on the rebound. After starting 0-5 last year, the Titans inserted Vince Young and went 8-3 to finish the season and have started this season at 6-3. So was Fisher just suddenly not a good coach for three years after being one of the best in the NFL for a time and is again doing well?? Nope. He is good and Saban is as well.


RTR

People forget that Dinardo was hired at LSU because he had success (a relative term here) at Vanderbilt. Vanderbilt even sued Dinardo (and got $ from LSU) for breach of contract. Dinardo was perceived to be a good coach when he went to LSU (and his recruiting numbers support that because the LSU facilities sure weren't the attraction at the time). Somehow he took better recruits at LSU (when compared to Vanderbilt) but did not have the success they expected in whoville given the relative success he had had in Nashville - 19-25 in 4 years in Nashville - had three 5 win seasons.

It seems fairly obvious that Saban will have Alabama back among the elite programs by 2009. There's too much tradition/support ect here to realistically think anything otherwise and it's only NCAA sanctions and a badly mismanaged athletic dept that have led to the past decade.
I will say that I'm still a bit on the fence about his 1st season here though. Of course, We don't have top ten talent but we do have top 20-25 talent so I would say that so far we certainly haven't overachieved.

"2004 LSU Football Signees

Lavelle Hawkins (WR/DB, 5'11", 185), Stockton, CA.
Jeremy Jones (TE, 6'5", 280), West Jefferson.
Herman Johnson (OL, 6'7", 380), Denton, Texas.
Xavier Carter (WR, 6'3", 190, 4.3) Melbourne, FL Palm Bay.
Harry Coleman (LB, 6'2", 212) West ST Mary.
Ali Highsmith (LB, 6'1", 228), Miami Central
Marlon Favorite (6'2", 310), West Jefferson.
Early Doucet (WR, 6'2", 210, 4.5), ST Martinville, LA .
Luke Sanders (LB, 6'3", 230, 4.6), West Monroe.
Jacob Hester (RB/FB, 6'0", 235, 4.5) Evangel.
Craig Steltz (SS, 6'2", 200) Rummel.
Chevis Jackson (WR/DB, 6'1", 180, 4.5), Mobile, ST Paul.
Charles Alexander (DL, 6'4", 280), Breaux Bridge.
E.J. Kuale (LB, 6'3", 225), Dodge City Community College.
Matt Stoltz (LB, 6'3", 238) Pulaski Academy in Little Rock.
Brett Helms (OL, 6'3", 300) from Stuttgart, Arkansas.
Ryan Miller (OL, 6'6", 300) Barbe.
Tremaine Johnson (DE/DL, 6'2", 260) Houston (Galena Park).
Mario Stevenson (CB, 6'2", 195) Northeast Mississippi Junior College.
Jeffery Jack, (DB, 5'10", 175, 4.5) Houston Madison.
Claude Wroten (DT, 6'3", 315) Mississippi Delta CC .
Curtis Taylor (SS/FE, 6'3", 180), Franklinton, Louisiana.
Max Holmes (C, 6'4", 288), Parkview Baptist.
Tim Washington (DE, 6'3", 261)Sugar Land, Texas
Mit Cole (TE, 6'4", 260) Picayune, Miss
Glenn Dorsey (DT, 6'2", 300) Gonzales, Louisiana
Tyson Jackson (DE, 6'5", 289) Edgard, Louisiana
Quinn Johnson (LB, 6'2", 230) Edgard, Louisiana

2003 LSU Football Signees

JaMarcuss Russell (QB, 6'5", 220) Mobile, AL
Dwayne Bowe (WR, 6'3", 200), Norland, Florida
Cornell Stewart (DE, 6'6", 295), John Curtis
Kirstin Pittmen (DE, 6'5", 252) East St. John's
LaRon Landry (DB, 6'2, 190, 4.4), Hahnville
Darryl Johnson (SS, 6'2", 200, 4.5), O.P. Walker
Craig Davis (WR, 6'3", 190, 4.55), O.P. Walker
Domonick Cooper (DE/LB, 6'4", 220) from O.P. Walker
Tim Washington (DE/DT, 6'3", 239) from Ft. Bend Dulles
Pat Fisher (P/K, 6'5", 230), Bowie, Maryland
Amp Hill (WR, 6'2", 195), Jacksonville, Florida
Ken Hollis (LB, 6'3", 245), E. Mississippi Junior College
Sean Merrill (DT, 6'5", 290), D'lberville, MS
Shawn Jordan (FB, 5'11", 240), Riverside high school in EL Paso, Texas
Darius Ingram (LB, 6'2", 215), Tenaha, Texas
Barrington Edwards (RB, 6'1", 210), Bowie, MD
Daniel Francis (CB, 5'11", 170, 4.4) Port Barre
Justin Vincent (RB, 6'0", 205), Barbe high school
Chris Jackson (P/K, 6'2", 180), John Curtis
Nick Child (CB, 6'1", 190), Rummel of N.O.
Jarod Carter (DE/DT, 6'3", 280, 4.8), John Curtis high school.
Matt Flynn (QB, 6'3", 218), Tyler Texas, Robert E. Lee high school
Jonathan Zenon (ATH, 6'2", 190, 4.5), Breaux Bridge
Jerry Sevin (OL, 6'2.5", 288, 4.9), John Curtis high school
Ally Broussard (RB, 6'1", 225, 4.5), Acadiana high school
Will Arnold (OT, 6'5", 320), Centerville, Mississippi Academy
Jessie Daniels (FS, 6'0", 180, 4.45), Breaux Bridge
Keith Zinger (TE, 6'5", 250), Leesville

2002 LSU Football Signees

Lawrence Williams, 6'3" LB, from Lutcher *
Terrell McGill, OL, 6'5", 300, Miami Norland
Troy Hankton, WR, 6'0", 180, Cohen high school of New Orleans
Junior Joseph, WR, 6'1", 175, O.P. Walker
Brian Johnson, 6'5", 300, OL, Tallahassee
Peter Dyanawski, 6'5", 290, Vancouver, British Columbia
Alonzo Manuel, DE, 6'3", 260, Jennings
Willie Demps, LB, 6'1", 220. Florida All-State linebacker from Pensacola
Dominique Owen, RB, 5'11",185,4.5 Fort Bend Kemper, Texas
Ryan Willis, DE, 6'4", 250, Holy Cross of N.O.
Paris Hodges, OL, 6'7", 330 ,Sacramento, California
Cameron Vaughn, 6'4", 215, LB, Shaw of N.O.
Kyle Williams, 6'4", 285, DT, Ruston
Chris Vincent, 6'2",210, RB/SS, Valley Forge Military *
Kerron Gordon, 6'1", 190, CB, 4.4
Tory Collins, 6'3", 260, DT, Fortier high school N.O.
Veron Russell, CB, 6'0", 180, 4.4, John Curtis high school
. Nate Livings, OL, 6'7", 300, Washington - Marion of Lake Charles
Justin Vincent RB, 5'11", 190, 4.4, Barbe of Lake Charles
Lester Ricard QB, 6'5", 195, Amite
Blair Irvin, JR, WR/DB, 5'11.5", 160, 4.38, Patterson *
Jason Spadoni, RB, 5'11", 198, John Curtis
Jeff Cook, QB, 6'2", 200, Notre Dame of Crowley
Garrett Wibel, OL, 6'3", 315, Rummell
Skyler Green, 5'10", 180, 4.35, ATH, L.W. Higgins of New Orleans
Doug Planchard, 6'4", 270, DT, Catholic of Baton Rouge

Back To Top

2001 LSU Football Signees

Joseph Addai, RB, 6'0", 195, Houston, Sharpstown
Steve Arflin, OL, 6'4", 310, Jacksonville, Florida, Fletcher
Jonathan Banks, OL, 6'6", 358, Baton Rouge, McKinley *
Bennie Brazell, WR, 6'1", 170, Houston, Westbury
Shyrone Carey, RB, 5'8", 190, New Orleans, Shaw
Rick Clausen, QB, 6'2", 180, Woodland Hills, California
Michael Clayton, WR, 6'4",1 90, Baton Rouge, Christian Life
Travis Daniels, WR/DB, 6'1", 175, Hollywood, FL, South Broward
Ryan Gilbert, RB/ATH, 5'11", 190, Dallas, Texas, Hillcrest
Donovan Grayson, LB/DE, 6'4, 230, New Orleans, Karr *
Kory Hebert, TE, 6'4", 235, Lafayette, Teurlings
Marquise Hill, DL, 6'7", 290, New Orleans, De La Salle
Brandon Hurley, DT, 6'3", 275, Monroe, Ouachita Christian
David Jones, TE, 6'4", 240, Silver Springs, Maryland, Springbrook
Nate Livings, OL, 6'5", 315, Lake Charles, Washington - Marion **
Phillip Maxwell, LB, 6'1", 225, Shreveport, Evangel
Rudy Niswanger, OL, 6'5", 275, Monroe, Ouachita Christian
Melvin Oliver, DE, 6'3", 255, Opelika, AL
Dave Peterson, LB, 6'2", 240, Bristol, FL, Coffeyville Kansas JUCO *
Tim Pope, LB, 6'2", 225, Springfield, FL, Rutherford *
Ronnie Prude, WR/DB, 6'0, 190, Shreveport, Fair Park
Marcus Spears, TE, 6'5", 280, Baton Rouge, Southern Lab
Brandon Washington, DE, 6'4", 275, Tuscaloosa, AL, Central
Andrew Whitworth, OL, 6'7", 315, West Monroe
Ben Wilkerson, C, 6'4", 275, Hemphill, Texas
Brandon Williams, DB, 6'2", 200, Port Allen *
Torran Williams, DT, 6'5", 295, Miami, FL, Dodge City JC

2000 LSU Football Signees

Eric Alexander, DB, 6'3", 190, Port Arthur,Texas
Jarvis Armelin, DL, 6'1", 280, Sulphur *
Dorsett Buckle, LB, 6'0", 220, Amite
Kade Comeaux, OL, 6'6", 305, Notre Dame of Crowley
Erin Damond, WR/DB, 5'11", 175, Bogalusa *
Randall Gay, RB, 6'0", 185, Brusly,LA
Devery Henderson, RB, 6'0", 180, Opelousas.
Chris Henry, DE, 6'6", 275, Houston, Texas (Jones) *
Drew Hixon, WR, 6'0", 180, Kennesaw, Georgia
Jack Hunt, WR, 6'0", 180, Ruston, LA
Rudy Johnson, LB/DB, 6'0", 190, Kentwood *
John Paul Jones, DL, 6'2", 275, Carencro *
Marvin Jones, LB, 5'10", 225, Hammond *
Chad Lavalais, DE, 6'3", 275, Marksville. ***
Daniel Leon, OL, 6'2", 305, ST Martinville *
Nate Livings, OL, 6'5", 305, Washington-Marion of LC **
Donriel Louis, WR, 6'1", 170, West ST John HS *
Adrian Mayes, DB, 6'2", 205, Houston
Travis Moses, DB, 6'1", 205, East Ascension HS
Derron Parquet, RB, 6'0", 205, Rummell *
Stephen Peterman, TE, 6'5", 260, ST Stanislaus HS
Marcus Randall, QB, 6'3", 215, Baton Rouge, Glenn Oaks
Jarvis Reyes, DE/LB, 6'3", 235, Loreauville
Demetri Robinson, TE, 6'2", 236, Lake City, Florida
Lionel Turner, LB, 6'3", 225, Walker
Corey Webster, WR, 6'0", 180, ST James
Brad West, DT, 6'3", 273, Gurley, Alabama *
Marcus Yanez, LB, 6'0", 210, Bastrop *"



RTR

Who were Saban's offensive and defensive coordinators in his first season at LSU?


RTR

quote:

Lawrence Williams, 6'3" LB, from Lutcher *
Terrell McGill, OL, 6'5", 300, Miami Norland
Troy Hankton, WR, 6'0", 180, Cohen high school of New Orleans
Junior Joseph, WR, 6'1", 175, O.P. Walker
Brian Johnson, 6'5", 300, OL, Tallahassee
Peter Dyanawski, 6'5", 290, Vancouver, British Columbia
Alonzo Manuel, DE, 6'3", 260, Jennings
Willie Demps, LB, 6'1", 220. Florida All-State linebacker from Pensacola
Dominique Owen, RB, 5'11",185,4.5 Fort Bend Kemper, Texas
Ryan Willis, DE, 6'4", 250, Holy Cross of N.O.
Paris Hodges, OL, 6'7", 330 ,Sacramento, California
Cameron Vaughn, 6'4", 215, LB, Shaw of N.O.
Kyle Williams, 6'4", 285, DT, Ruston
Chris Vincent, 6'2",210, RB/SS, Valley Forge Military *
Kerron Gordon, 6'1", 190, CB, 4.4
Tory Collins, 6'3", 260, DT, Fortier high school N.O.
Veron Russell, CB, 6'0", 180, 4.4, John Curtis high school
. Nate Livings, OL, 6'7", 300, Washington - Marion of Lake Charles
Justin Vincent RB, 5'11", 190, 4.4, Barbe of Lake Charles
Lester Ricard QB, 6'5", 195, Amite
Blair Irvin, JR, WR/DB, 5'11.5", 160, 4.38, Patterson *
Jason Spadoni, RB, 5'11", 198, John Curtis
Jeff Cook, QB, 6'2", 200, Notre Dame of Crowley
Garrett Wibel, OL, 6'3", 315, Rummell
Skyler Green, 5'10", 180, 4.35, ATH, L.W. Higgins of New Orleans
Doug Planchard, 6'4", 270, DT, Catholic of Baton Rouge

Care to go through how many of Saban's 02 recruiting class ever saw the field much less contributed?

6 or 7 of that whole group, and only 3 made the NFl draft and only 2 of that whole group is playing.

The '02 class also was not one of his more highly rated ones either. But most classes rarely have more than 6 or 7 that make a big impact.

Pretty sure that Justin Vincent and Skyler Green were difference makers. Seems that Vincent was the guy running all over Georgia to get LSU into the national title game...so I would say that one player for that one game alone made a big enough difference if it gets both an SEC and national title.


http://lsu.rivals.com/commitlist.asp

http://rivals100.rivals.com/TeamRank.asp?postype=0&sort=0&year=2002

Rated #15 overall class on rivals, also #15 class on scout. Solid but not great, but with good coaching they do not always have to be great since Saban sandwiched that class with stellar classes in 2001 and 2003. Many of his 2003 and 2004 guys are playing as evidenced by the stat of 19 of 24 total starters this year were his players.

http://recruiting.scout.com/a.z?s=73&p=9&c=14&yr=2002


RTR

quote:

Pretty sure that Justin Vincent and Skyler Green were difference makers. Seems that Vincent was the guy running all over Georgia to get LSU into the national title game...so I would say that one player for that one game alone made a big enough difference if it gets both an SEC and national title

True but both those difference makers were coming to LSU pretty much know matter what. And they weren't at LSU long enough for Saban to "coach them up"

Sadly, both were pretty much NFL busts.

That class was 3 years into Saban full recruiting and coming off the 01 SEC Championship and it was for the most part a bust.

I'm not talking NFL, I'm saying probably half the kids he signed never had any significant contribution to the team while at LSU.

Justin Vincent, MVP of both the 2003 SEC Championship game vs. Georgia with over 200 yards rushing.
MVP vs. Oklahoma for the national championship.

I would say that he alone made that class worth it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Vincent

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skyler_Green

RTR

Cameron Vaughn also contributed at LSU:


"He was a three-year starter at Louisiana State University, where he played 52 career games (33 starts) and totaled 239 tackles (121 solo) along with seven sacks (44 yds.). Vaughn started at weakside linebacker as a sophomore and junior before moving to middle linebacker as a senior for the Tigers. In his first year as a starter at middle linebacker in 2005, Vaughn led the Tigers with 83 tackles (46 solo) and added 6.5 tackles-for-losses with one sack as a 13-game starter. He worked as LSU’s starting weakside linebacker as a sophomore and junior, posting 55 tackles in 2003 and 63 tackles in 2004. He recorded six starts during LSU’s 2003 season that saw the school capture a share of the national championship (BCS). The linebacker also earned a spot on the SEC Academic Honor Roll following the 2003 campaign. Vaughn was voted to the SEC All-Freshman Team in 2002 by the league’s coaches as the only LSU true freshman to play every game, finishing the year with 38 tackles. Rated the No. 9 linebacker in the nation by Rivals.com at Archbishop Shaw High School in Marrero, La., Vaughn was a Class 5A second-team all-state choice and district MVP as a senior. He majored in kinesiology at LSU. Cameron Jude Vaughn was born Feb. 27, 1984, in Terrytown, La."

I guess I will have to look up every single player in the class to show you what everyone else already knows.


RTR

Lester Ricard transferred to Tulane and played well there, not really Saban's fault.

http://tulanegreenwave.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/ricard_lester00.html

RTR

OL Nate Livings was very good at LSU and did contribute as well...also made it to the NFL:

"COLLEGE: Played at LSU from 2002-05 ... Started all 13 games as a senior (12 at LG and one at LOT), and was credited with 109 knockdown blocks and 14 "pins" ... Played every offensive snap in six games as a senior, and was called for only one penalty all season ... As a junior, started eight games at ROT and three games at RG ... Made 10 starts at LG in 2003, helping LSU claim BCS national title."
http://www.bengals.com/team/player.asp?player_id=108

RTR

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tory_Collins

Tory Collins also went on to the NFL.

Kyle Williams played well and contributed at LSU:

"Kyle Williams DT 6’1 299 LSU
By: Robert Davis

Kyle Williams has been a vital part of LSU’s success over the past few years. He’s been a mainstay on the interior line since his sophomore season when he finished the season with 41 tackles, 6.5 for loss, and four sacks. He improved on all of those as a junior, when he tallied 57 tackles, 12 for loss, and six sacks. He earned All SEC honors in 2004. He finished his senior campaign with 60 tackles, 7.5 for loss, and 4.5 sacks.

Williams’ biggest strength is just the intensity he plays with on the field. He will never be outworked and goes full tilt until the whistle blows. He can take on blockers, hold his ground, and make plays in the running game. Williams also shows the burst off the snap to get penetration and make plays in the backfield."

RTR

He did go 8-4 with a Peach bowl win over Ga Tech so I would not say it is a better season yet.